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“Just how many building sites have you work on?”
The word is “worked”, and its probably been about 40 ish THIS year numbnuts, I’ve already mentioned what I do for a living lol
And I take on one trainee, although theyre actually called (“mates” seeing as its electric) per year but dont pay for any certification for them until I’ve had two years out of them
But despite what you seem to believe from the government spin we DONT have a shortage of electricians, plumbers, gas engineers or even nurses in this country, certainly not in the midlands at least
Nurses being the best example, we imported several thousand foreign nurses many of which we’re now stuck with, many of whom couldnt even speak english, many of whom arrived with HIV or Aids the treatment of which far outpaces their tax contributions, many of which with kids whos education costs far surpass their tax contributions and all because an alleged shortage of nurses
A shortage despite the fact that only 1 in 3 nurses born and educated in THIS country ever get a job nursing here which isnt an isolated occurence in an isolate sector
So before you start believing spin try checking your facts eh?
But sidetracking back from the divergence, the point is that council housing COULD be run as not only a profitable business on many levels but it could also be a far more effective method of training than college only based training
The problem ISNT that we have public sector housing, the problem is that its managed innefficiently and fixing that is a far better thing to do than simply scrapping the concept which is simply the lazy approach
And out of curiosity is english youre third language perchance?
Its seems ironically comical that youre claiming education is SOOOOOOOOOOO fabulously successful and yet seem to have grammar (thats not your grandads wife btw) and spelling (nothing to do with magic) of a 12 year old with learning dissabilities
Perhaps if youre own language skills are what you class as “good” then our scholastic system WOULD seem ab fab to you, but its far from the case when viewed from even an average intellectual level that I would hope you may one day aspire to
A few facts for YOU
Most school leaveRs are going onto higher education, than doing apprenticeships.
Not MOST, “more than before” as a percentage, but over a million 16-18 year olds dont even show up on those statistics as they now cant claim dole and ARENT in further education
Many of the ones IN further education are still there trying to pass the GCSE’s they were nowhere near passing when they should have been, we also have a higher rate of children leaving school with numeracy and illiteracy issues than we had 10 or 20 years ago which is rising year on year
“Most companies are not running apprenticeship programs any more dew to the high numbers of adult tradesman’s who still working”
You’ll find thats mostly due to foriegn tradesmen immigrating here as our own apprentice trained ones are the highest group of people emmigrating out of the country, we are currently losing nearly half a million people a year all of whom are the better skilled people with the better work ethics rather than the dregs as we seem to be the only country in the world who welcomes other peoples cast offs and useless folks with open arms and a benefit cheque
“Most building sites only have a few English workers on them”
That would depend on area I guess, around here you WONT be employed if your british english on many sites which are now all polish, same goes for many of the companies I do work for around here including but not limited to 4 bus and coach companies, two engineering firms, at least a dozen packing companies, a rag recycling company, three window and conservatory manufacturers, 3 security companies and 5 building firms
Because the poles will do a 60-80 hour week for a 40 hour minimum wage salary
“And all councils offer a welfare package for low paid or the umployable who rent from private landlords”
They offer the same whether its private or council, which with many private rents equates to them paying £10-20 more upto the max they will pay and then family themselves having to top up anything above that, many private landlords also WONT rent to anyone on benefits
“You kind of thinking of liberal wishy washy thinking is the reason we are such a problem in the first place.”
Either you dont actually read anything I write or you dont actually know what a liberal is, cant decide which it is, maybe its both
“Why don’t you go back to picking up your benefits and leave the thinking to those who have to pay your rent”
I’m an electrical contracter, I employ 9 technical and 3 office staff so duh
“Try getting a job and start living in the real world.”
The one you seem to live in ISNT the real one, just because it might seem that way to you merely means your prozac dosage is perhaps a bit too high or doesnt mix with your alcohol intake too favourably
“I do hate total morons like you who think they know better than the rest of us.”
Stop talking then and you will be much more chilled!!
What do you have a GCSE in politics? May be “AS” in art?
Purely technical and management, but I’m beginning to think you have a degree in Soap opera studies as time passes
As for the benefit system, I’ve spent the majority of my working life in the 40% tax bracket and didnt resent it for one moment as coming from a working class background with many friends who genuinely needed help and then also needing it myself after the IT crash after 9/11 I dont think the majority we are led to believe is taking the piss
But as with the US the new way of governing is misdirection, make everyone believe a group or subset of society is to blame for all the ills and poor services in the country then you have their support to hit the already hardest hit as much as you like
When in reality it merely distracts from the real money wasters who are the government, buy any issue of Private eye and use a calculator to add up the non benefit related money being wasted by councils on nonsense, extrapolate that to all other councils and the other 25 fortnights in a year and you get a picture of where the money for public services is REALLY going
But the media only reports extreme and rare cases as tho they are commonplace and thats what people then start to believe is the case, yet nobody batted an eyelid and most werent even aware we gave 10 billion quid to africa last year for schools when our own schools are suffering miserably most of which was earmarked for british and american building companies working there and which as always will only in part be spent on any actual building work, how much benefit does THAT give people here? How well a spend is THAT of tax payers money?
Immigration is also a key topic on this, the government has finally admitted immigrants get houses as a priority, atop that they are SUPPOSED to be a financial benefit to the country
But ONLY a healthy single childless immigrant who can speak english and has skills we need will be a positive financial impact, but they arent the requirements we have
Any iimmigrant with an illness, a non working spouse, a child or who needs to be educated before working will take far more out of the system than they pay in tax,, their kids will negatively affect indigenous kids education and their health requirements will overstretch cash starved resources
Atop that many of them dont even spend money here more than necessary which aids the economy, they send it back home making the financial negative impact compounded
But that isnt an issue the government wants to discuss, they would rather have people blaming the indigenous unemployed and single mothers or thwe aged
But people just swallow it as fact
Ok fairy snuff then
But most of those I covered earlier
The council homes are only expensive to run because they are being made to be, private landlords even ones maintaining thousands of properties do so AND make a profit
I would rather see a family who couldnt afford to buy by any other method buy an ex council house than a massive company who would actually get it even cheaper or for free as has happened when many of the housing association partnerships have been set up
If a company can run the same housing stock, renovate it AND make a profit then IMO a better set of questions would revolve around why the council cant seem to manage it
Secondly, remove council housing and you have a climate where landlords can then price people out of housing of any sort just because they dont fit the profile they are looking for
Council housing isnt the issue, the issue is the efficiency, completely get rid of it and you STILL pay peoples rents, you just pay more for them as private rents are higher AND you line the pockets of someone who is in most cases already loaded to begin with and who probably got given all their council houses for free which is surely more unpallateable?
I personally would like to see as I said the housing managed by the council but as effeciently as a private company does it, for the monies that would be profit for that private company then ploughed back into building more houses (again like a business), the staff that maintain them could also be allowed to work as a company meaning council gas fitters, electricians, glaziers, carpenters, builders etc would be in part or whole subsidised by competing with local tradesmen
Aside from that use them to build the new houses whilst using unskilled unemployed people to act initially as labourers to reduce the costs but whilst also teaching them skills in the form of an on the job apprenticeship that isnt in a classroom but on a building site thus adding to their work experience as well as their skillset
A percentage of the housing could then be sold off directly to fund the operation short term with the rents from the others funding it long term as a rolling replacement of housing stocks and then only the properties over a certain age would be sold off leaving the remaining housing stock as being always newer than say 25 or 50 years old
As I said, as with many nationally owned or run services the cost isnt the problem as they invariably cost the tax payer more if privatised as with rail, electricity, water etc etc ad infinitum, the problem isnt the fact its nationally owned, its the fact its not run efficiantly, selling it off is a case of throwing the baby out with the bath water and just serves to line rich peoples pockets, perpetuate golf club politics and back handers whilst shafting the poor majority at every turn
“If you want something to be different to how its always been you have to do something you’ve never done before”
Can anyone else see the inconsistency of point and total contradicition in there?
“Maybe if you would like to see more funding for local schools”
“instead of making the rest of us subsidizer your children’s schools and heath care”
Also
“and don’t have anything to again by joining such Committee’s”
And yet you started off and then continued with criticising how government money is spent, isnt THAT something you would have to gain? The ability to influence it in a way you DO agree with?
Or is it just more preferable to not put any real effort in and whinge like a girl who missed some jimmy chu shoes in a sale?
You seem to be happily swallowing the governments jiz and drinking down willingly, the entire public spend on schools, benefits of EVERY kind and subsidised housing pales into insignificance compared to the amount the government wastes of frivolities, donates to foriegn countries to line rich peoples pockets, gives to companies in the name of subsidies and fleeces the population out of in the gise of PFI’s, select committees, assett striping of businesses and public services and their resale to private companies owned by politicians friends who they have shares in and get given cushy chairmanships on as a thank you along an endless stream of manipulations of rules
But the government says immigrants, the unemployed, single mums, pensioners or whoever they choose for that month is the “cause” and the “bad guy” and like a well trained brainless pavlovian puppy you swallow everything they offer to the hilt and then bend over willingly just for good measure lol
You, and people like you are everything thats wrong with this country because you blindly believe everything youre tiold without question as tho its true, youre a willing puppet to spin
Femme, showing a pic of the girl doesnt alter the reason this thread exists which is because of how unbothered those same parents where to begin with
This thread and countless others like it on message boards the world over also arent hampering her being found nor are they an express view that she shouldnt be found (a subtle difference, but a difference nonetheless)
As for it being a circus, it already is, its been made into one by the parents and teh media and NOT by people expressing their views on it AFTER the fact
I also havent seen anyone being unkind to their “plight”, how would that go then? People saying they think her parents shouldnt deseve to find her or what? What IS happening tho is people commenting on how they got INTO this plight, discussing their dilligence, concern and neglect all of which isnt to do with the “plight”, its to do with how and why they arrived here
Views in support or denigration of the two parents wont alter whether or not the girl is found or whether she will be alive if she is
But a less than victim pandering fluffy outcry about it MIGHT just make the next pair of MCanns think twice before treating their kids like a pet hamster
Well if YOU dont think that then dont YOU do it eh?
Firstly any and every opinion (even yours) is equally valid as well as at this juncture being equally likely of being right, just because a particular possibility isnt one you like to think about niether magically means it cant be the case nor does your disliking of it mean it shouldnt be voiced
Human nature dictates that people WILL think what they think when faced with a set of things before them, trying to say they should somehow think something other than they naturally think just because you dont agree with it or like it is just a tad ridiculous
You also seem to have a rather odd view of what people “do”, do YOU fervently sit by the telly looking for the latest snippet on this pair of neglectful parents? No? So why do you assume anyone whos views dont match yours DOES?
Chances are most people commenting are no more or less avidly following this than you, unless the fact you also have an opinion on the matter proves youre obsessively watching the coverage of course, which doesnt mean anyone else is
As for “implying” they had something to do with it, why not?
They could have, nothing thats come to light has proven otherwise nor has it proven they did. So its no less a likely nor outlandish possibility than any other possiblility at the moment with an equal chance of being the actual case here
The fact many find such things hard to think about let alone discuss is one of the reasons its so easy for so many to get away with it as people en masse try to avoid thinking that way unless its unnavoidable, which in turn makes it far less likely people who DO do that will get caught (I said “do do” how naughty lol)
You seem to be making a hell of a lot of assumptions about people based on the exact same things youre doing and yet miraculously coming to different conclusions purely because their suspicions dont match yours, care to explain that?
The rather left wing tactic of demonising any view you dont like only works on retards, and retards dont tend to be the most common posters on message boards except for ones on dating sites
Oh yeah, a ghetto btw osnt formed purely because its council housing, nor because people are poor
Its brought into existence by a collective grouping of people devioud of morality, decency and consideration for others
Money also isnt an issue as everyone whatever colour gets the same benefits, infact as all councils have dedicated advisorts to advise ethnics on what benefits they can claim but whites have to figure it out themselves chances are the ethnics will be getting more rather than the same or less on average
And yet we have oodles of whities living in council housing on the exact same money but WITHOUT it being called or resembling a “ghetto”, why do you think that is if housing and money is frequently cited as the cause?
Perhaps the problem isnt the housing, isnt the fact they are poor, isnt even their skin colour as many of the same colour DONT live in such an animalistic way
Perhaps its just the people themselves living the only way they are capable of living, like animals rather than civilised human beings but then trying to blame everyone but themselves for it afterwards
I dont think getting rid of council housing is exactly a move forward, like with privatisation of the utilities and privatisation of services the problem isnt that they CANT be run effectively, merely that they arent
If a private landlord can manage to meet all requirements, rent a property AND make a living then a council that doesnt have to make a profit SHOULD be far more capable
Add to that the fact that many of the “poor folks” you mention are on benefits and ghetto their rent paid and you actually increase the governments outlay by making them then have to rent more expensive private housing as well as lining someone elses pocket into the bargain
That particular angle hasnt been missed by the politicians either, property and shares in property leasing companies has been one of the largest growth investments of politicians private investments for the last decade which as when they were doing the same shift into utility companies and then later private health care companies would seem to indicate the long term goal is to asset strip our housing stock too so the already rich can become even richer
When a council sells of a council house to its tenant they dont actually get the money, it goes to central government, which then at its discretion often sends it abroad to third world countries to line millionaires pockets there.
What we SHOULD IMO be doing is having council led building programs of cheap housing for rental, perhaps with some being sold off to finance the venture along the way and with it niether reveiving nor giving any money to central government
Aside from that it would also be a good way to teach people in a real enviroment every building skill from surveying through bricklaying, carpentry, plastering, plumbing, electrics up to building inspection at a reduced cost whilst improving and replacing the housing stock
Looking at this as an outlay only problem is the way the government WANTS you to look at it, when in the real world renting and building houses is a money spinner for everyone it seems except the government, which is also the only organisation whos employees cant also line their own pockets from it oddly enough, quelle surprise!!!! :shock:
As with many other public services, the aim here is to run it down to the point where people WANT it to be privatised, and then the people who already have more money than they will ever need can make even more once the government has approval to sell off the housing stock for peanuts as its already doing around the country with the intervention of housing trust schemes where a private company can renovate the houses to new specs AND make a profit all on the same rent?????????
So how come the council couldnt?
Answer is they could have IF the people at the top WANTED them to, but wheres the retirement fund in that approach?
And Slayer, you said if someone doesnt like something dont watch it didnt ya? So where was I taking something you said out of context?
Are you saying you DO like watching things about people being murdered then? Or kids being abducted, molested and killed? That its enjoyable fun entertainment for you?
The news, life and pretty much everything is a mixture of good and bad, the people who avoid the stuff they dont like and ONLY see, hear or imagine the things they do at the expense of the rest mostly end up in therapy, on prozac or in a mental institution
Life is about balance, and we need to know about and form opinions about the good as much as the bad, more so in some cases
Hopefully such a loud negative opinion on this MIGHT make other crappy selfish parents reconsider doing the same thing, whereas if they bought into the victim pandering nonsense being peddled here that “they couldnt have averted this”, “that they didnt do anything wrong” or “it was a simple mistake anyone could have made” they would be more likely to do it themselves and more kids could vanish as a result (assuming the parents arent involved of course which CANT be ruled out)
Most news is “bad”, most news stories wont be liked my most people whether its things like this or the latest government feeble excuse to raise more taxes to send to african millionaires in the guise of charity but its a persons responsibility to know as much about those things as it is to know about some geriatric piss smelling old womans cat being rescued from a tree
We SHOULD know about the world and the country we live in, the good and the bad, the things we like as well as the ones we dont like in order to get balance, form a view and vote, protest or support accordingly, its an integral part of not only an oligarchy (the form of politics we have that idiots think is actually a democracy) but its also a part of social responsibility and self eductation to the world as it is NOW, not some fluffy deluded offset idealistic fantasy view of what the world is
Seeing and hearing about incontrivertibly bad parenting is an easy way to learn and remember it and hopefully a step towards other parents doing better or raising their kids to do better in this instance, ignoring it because you dont “like it” is a surefire way to see much much more of the same thing
