Time for a Cull?

As a thought experiment fine, i’d imagine everyone would say kill all of any animal rather than kill their child.

Shamefully I haven’t read all the posts here, and Mr Pikey is far too posh for me to fully get to grips with :wink:

So please forgive me if I am misunderstanding the thread somewhat, but I’m replying to Pete’s comment regarding foxes killing out of spite.

I agree Pete, I don’t think they do kill out of spite, but I beleive they do what is in their nature to do. I live in the country and have seen at first hand what a fox can do to a chicken coop, they do get in a frenzy and kill for killings sake, as they haven’t taken their kill for food, just left it. I have also seen the result of a fox killing a goose, it bit it’s head off and buried it, and left the body.

I’m not stupid and I’m not a liar – but they do kill for killings sake if they get in a frenzy :(

@pete wrote:

Next time a fox gets into a chicken coop persuade the owner to keep his distance after the fox has done his killing and see what the fox does. I’ll bet a years wages he comes back and takes the other dead chickens. The only species kills for pleasure or fun is man. If the fox was that destructive how do we manage to have free range chickens in the shops ?
Any animal disturbed after his kill will abandon it if it isn’t strong enough to defend it.
It’s not nice for the chicken owners but the fox is simply doing what comes naturally, i’ll also wager another years salary that dogs kill far more livestock than foxes ever will, they certainly kill and maim more children.

Thats very true pete they will keep coming back and taking them until the bury the whole coop of massacred chicken, it is natural for them to kill they are hunters/ predators and should be treated as such and not as cute little basil brushes in the back garden that you hand feed like a pet dog or cat, they need treating like wild animals that they are and not welcomed into either our back garden / houses or chicken coops. It is natural for them to hunt and kill small mammals mainly, but people will insist on curbing this natural instinct by feeding them instead and indeed allowing them to rumage through bins. They have lost their natural fear of both human and dog, hence the tragic events, you cant blame the fox for it, the babies were probably waving their arms making a noise as a chicken will do if a fox enters a coop the foxes response is a killing frenzy. Before we went soft on them a fox wouldnt dream of enter a house it smells of humans, humans should be avoided, the smell of a human now no longer holds that fear, its about time we made them be the wild animals they are again and if you want to admire them do it from afar.
Since the hunting ban the mange infested foxes (and the generally ill and infirm) now roam without the fear of a natural cull by a hunt, these are not only effecting more and more domestic pets with mange, it is getting rife now, but also looking for easier pickings as they are too ill or unable to hunt naturally, the answer is not to do a mass cull as the chances are it will be the younger more active and more healthy foxes that will be seen out and about, possibly even mothers with cubs, and for everyone you do kill another will just move into the territory. It would be far better to re introduce hunting (not den diggings )to cleanse these ill and old foxes (as despite hype a hound cannot catch a young healthy fox its virtually impossible) and make a fox an unwanted pest in cities and towns again and not encouraging them.

@pete wrote:

Apart from reintroducing hunting i agree, though i dont think the fox was attacking the children as potential prey personally. Hunting does nothing to keep numbers in check it’s a fallacy, but we’ve been here before :lol:

A fox will enter a chicken coop if it goes unoticed it will take a single bird and be away again, it is when the fox is noticed and the chicken start to flap and cluck and make noise it sends them into the killing frenzy, i cant believe a fox would jump into a cot and just bite 2 kids for no apparent reason other than to bite them, something caused him to do this either he wanted to take one as prey or they caused a similar response that a coop of scared hens would do and the noise or movement caused the fox to bite them both as he / she did. Hunting doesnt keep numbers in check your quite correct the amount of foxes caught are insignificant to managing the populations,in as far as actual numbers are concerned, but what it does do is rid the old and infirm foxes, it is / was their only predator, almost every animal in mother nature has a clean up system of ridding these, a pack of wolves will take out the weak or old elk, a pack of lions will aim to take out the same buffalo, gazelle etc its the law of the land. A fox doesnt have this besides man and hound hunting them, and it is proven that the foxes that do the damage to livestock is more often than not the old and infirm its easier pickings than trying to catch small mammals in the fields that are too fast for them a chicken in a coop cant get away, that said foxes are also opportunists and healthy foxes will also if stumbling across an easy kill take advantage of this, but usually they will weigh the risk of human or dog presence and smell versus need, and not take the risk but stick to hunting away from homesteads. But their fear is getting less as has been seen and that could sooner than even i thought start to cause major problems, disease has increased in foxes also because the ill are not being naturally culled from being hunted, mange and leptosporisis two of the main killers being spread more and more through the healthier ones because the ill ones are just dieing a slow and lingering death spreading more and more disease.Toxocariasis is another disease easily spread to humans typically crawling toddlers in your gardens, exactly the same as you can get from dog faeces that people are always up in arms about but willingly allow foxes into their gardens carrying the self same parasite. Ask any vet about the increase of just these diseases/ infestations in domestic pets and indeed increase in humans of Toxocariasis and you will see how much damage it has done to the system already. That said…if you want to reduce fox numbers not hunting them will infact long term have a better chance of achieving that in just this way, so maybe thats the answer let them self regulate gradually more and more dieing of these diseases and others, all the while risking sharing their disease and whatever else happens in the meantime to us too.