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Listen and believe … Or does the Duluth model only apply when it is convenient? (I wanted to bring up femminist critical theory in this thread too)
Forgive my ignorance, but what is the Duluth model, and how is it relevant to a thread on bullying??
Brnging in critical theory (whether Marxist of feminist) seems to muddy the waters.
This thread’s interest for me springs from whether people who are bullied are weak or not, and whther their parents are to blame.
All sorts of theories can be thrown around, but it’s a question of common sense and practical experience.
Drac, I know very little about you, though I like your willingness to stand up against the trend. I can easily imagine from what I do know about you, that you have been subject to a lot of pretty nasty bullying in life, and that you’ve stood up to it.
That’s admirable, but just because you have doesn’t make others weak-charactered. I’ve yet to see how you can bear out the argument that parents should be able to tell when their kid is under intense pressure which leads to suicide. That may be true of an adult (I remember when i was 20 talking to a group of people and being aware that there was something seriously wrong with some guy despite his silence – he committed suicide shortly afterwards), but at a certain stage in adolescence then your peers are more important than your parents.
Most adolescents become jealously possessive of their privacy, and their lives at school. The inwardness and tendency to buck at routines like eating etc (my memory of adolescents is that they don’t eat – they graze) can be just as much a sign of adolescent growing problems as they are of suicide.
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Forgive my ignorance, but what is the Duluth model, and how is it relevant to a thread on bullying??
The Duluth model (as implemented) usually states that all claims of violence against a women must automaticly be believe. Proponents of this model usually also are the type that say that words are a type of violence. (The Duluth model also states that the women is always the vicim of the abuse, even if they are the agressor). It is something I recommend reading about, as it is used in court cases in many countries.
I found it odd that Ge asked for evidence of any bullying happening, despite apparently believing in this kind of ideology (Saying that proposing to a women is also violence in the tennis thread..
Drac, I know very little about you, though I like your willingness to stand up against the trend. I can easily imagine from what I do know about you, that you have been subject to a lot of pretty nasty bullying in life, and that you’ve stood up to it.
This is correct.
That’s admirable, but just because you have doesn’t make others weak-charactered. I’ve yet to see how you can bear out the argument that parents should be able to tell when their kid is under intense pressure which leads to suicide.
Maybe I haven’t made this clear, but I don’t believe in many of these cases that the bullying is the only reason that suicide is commited. I believe that for someone to be driven to do so from such actions also requires a pre-existing mental health issue. Probably some kind of anxiety or paranoia based disorder. It is just as important, if not more so to treat this as well as stopping the bullying.
I would also say that in many cases the underlying issue is the reason they are being bullied in the first place. The bully can percieve that they are ‘different’ somehow, so choses them as the target of abuse rather than someone else.
I would also say that in many cases the underlying issue is the reason they are being bullied in the first place. The bully can percieve that they are ‘different’ somehow, so choses them as the target of abuse rather than someone else.
If this is true, then it also raises the question why the bully can detect that something is wrong, why can’t the child’s parents?
I would also say that in many cases the underlying issue is the reason they are being bullied in the first place. The bully can percieve that they are ‘different’ somehow, so choses them as the target of abuse rather than someone else.
If this is true, then it also raises the question why the bully can detect that something is wrong, why can’t the child’s parents?
Probably because the one being bullied hides it. The bully will make it clear that if anyone is told, ie parents,police etc, then they will be in BIG trouble, so they bottle it up until they cant take any more. Then you know what happens.
Some observation regarding this thread :
I don’t agree that everyone who commits suicide is “mentally ill” as firstly how would one quantify what is mentally ill or not. For eg if someone was terminally ill and in pain would them taking their own life qualify as being mentally ill simply because it was contrary to what was regarded by society as “normal behaviour”. To me it would be a logical albeit unorthodox step to take.
Regarding this poor lad, he was bullied in person so blocking would have done very little to help his plight on social media / texts etc. He was also of an age where he brain was still developing so not sure a mental illness tag would ever be appropriate in this instance. That said, I have limited sympathy for people continually complaining about online trolling as adults like numerous celebrities do on twitter… the reality is there will always be a significant proportion of the population who will be continually critical of everything which is part and parcel of life. If someone is driven to tears as we have read on this thread by that and doesn’t have physical interaction with this person away from a computer then I would question their mental state in not being able to separate the cyber world from the real one . Linda I believe it was claimed she was driven to tears by jc chat trolls.. for someone working with vulnerable people in real life I find that not only bizarre but on the borderline of mental illness by its very definition in its own right.
The reality is law enforcement agencies have enough to cope with in the real world and this fad of celebrities reporting people to police for being called sluts etc whilst distasteful is completely avoidable by turning the bloody computer off. The argument is why should they have to, but the reality is we live in a world of unpleasant individuals and when booting up the computer, that individual is exercising free will to be exposed to it which isn’t the same as real life and it being foisted upon you with no action precipitating it. If someone is bored at home actively logging into social media being trolled , they need to be pro active themselves and stop doing it if it damages their fragile mindset to such an extent. This wasn’t the case in this poor lads suicide.
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Probably because the one being bullied hides it. The bully will make it clear that if anyone is told, ie parents,police etc, then they will be in BIG trouble, so they bottle it up until they cant take any more. Then you know what happens.
Yes, but for the bully to be able to tell that there is something wrong with their intended target, there must be some recognisable signs that they are acting off. If these can be recognised and taught to parents then it may allow any issues to be identified earlier and for an appropriate treatment to be started.
Probably because the one being bullied hides it. The bully will make it clear that if anyone is told, ie parents,police etc, then they will be in BIG trouble, so they bottle it up until they cant take any more. Then you know what happens.
Yes, but for the bully to be able to tell that there is something wrong with their intended target, there must be some recognisable signs that they are acting off. If these can be recognised and taught to parents then it may allow any issues to be identified earlier and for an appropriate treatment to be started.
Drac a lot of time, there doesnt have to be anything ‘wrong’ with their intended target at all. It could be something as simple as wearing the wrong kind of clothes, or their hair colour, or even the fact they do well at school. Sometimes there is no reason…they do it because they get an evil kick out of it. Plus they often have an adoring gang of bullies following them around.
Kids who are bullied will hide it, and be very careful not to give off any signs at all. Parents find out when it’s too late. Then they’ll find a hidden diary or something, and torture themselves thinking they were at fault for not knowing. The only one at fault here is the bully.
I don’t agree that everyone who commits suicide is “mentally ill” as firstly how would one quantify what is mentally ill or not. For eg if someone was terminally ill and in pain would them taking their own life qualify as being mentally ill simply because it was contrary to what was regarded by society as “normal behaviour”. To me it would be a logical albeit unorthodox step to take.
I didn’t say that everyone who commits sucide is mentally ill, only suicides that are ’caused’ by bullying. Or to phase it differently, someone with mental health issues is much more likely to commit suicide if they are bullied than someone who does not have the same issues.
He was also of an age where he brain was still developing so not sure a mental illness tag would ever be appropriate in this instance.
I’m really sure I understand why you think that children can’t suffer from mental health problems. Just because their brain is still developing doesn’t mean that there can’t be anything wrong with it.
Many conditions, autism for example are usually diagnosed during childhood, and have symptoms that lessen into adulthood.
Drac a lot of time, there doesnt have to be anything ‘wrong’ with their intended target at all. It could be something as simple as wearing the wrong kind of clothes, or their hair colour, or even the fact they do well at school. Sometimes there is no reason…they do it because they get an evil kick out of it. Plus they often have an adoring gang of bullies following them around.
I’m well aware of this, but it isn’t always the case.
Drac a lot of time, there doesnt have to be anything ‘wrong’ with their intended target at all. It could be something as simple as wearing the wrong kind of clothes, or their hair colour, or even the fact they do well at school. Sometimes there is no reason…they do it because they get an evil kick out of it. Plus they often have an adoring gang of bullies following them around.
I’m well aware of this, but it isn’t always the case.
99.9 times it is Drac.
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