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Posts
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Green? God no you would never catch me wearing green. I totally look shit in colours.
Credit to you janeylou that was funny. I apologise and i do actually wish you all the best x I am sorry honestly. Some people are just meant to be and some people when together are toxic. I think that you two are well matched and i wish you both well xxxx the pic i saw of you both together was like two kindred spirits in love. love is hard to find x im glad you are with him now.
I so love when a person with multiple talents can judge others by own perfection and attitudes that apply for them only… wow.. now where that dam plunger..my toilet seems to be backed up with same old doo..doo..
Take you out to the ball game..one, two..three strikes you OUT! at the old ball game…..
Actually i do have multiple talents, i can write and type breathe and i often go to the toilet all by myself although i do need a half hour sleep after due to my fatness and being hookerying all night for my crack, lol and yes i can unblock a toilet as my late father was a plumber. Did you know you can unblock your toilet with a large fizzy pop bottle cut in half.
I hope you all have a great new year x
I might not be finished btw x
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This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by
Artful Dodger.
Dodger,
I enjoy your poems, and I love your love of poetry.
I don’t fully agree with your criticisms, but I recognise that they’re positive in their intent.
That makes them different from the criticism I once raised against people who wrote poems here. I was very scathing,. I was quite an a-hole, holding a ‘superior’ standard of literary criticism as a criterion against which I could laugh at people and their puny efforts. I was an -a-hole
.Some would say I still am
but so far they have yet to convince me.Someone called mizzy (lol
) convinced me just how much of an a-hole I was in poetry, taking a positive and encouraging attitude to everyone’s attempts.What a shame that you tend to push the self-destruct button when you make cruel criticisms of some of the people here. Nasty and cruel. You devalue yourself. We all know you can be clever and withering, but to what end when you seek to humiliate people?
Humiliating people isn’t something to be proud of. We do it too often without meaning to, so actually setting out to humiliate is just not on at all. Everyone has their own hard battle to wage, without you (or I) making it worse.
That won’t stop me being withering in my ciriticms of other people’s opinions, but that’s different. That not humiliating them, it’s engaging with their argument. That’s how progress occurs – or should occur, anyway.
So keep your finger off the self-destruct button (self-destruct is something in which we all excel) and you can shine
4 members liked this post.
Dodger,
I enjoy your poems, and I love your love of poetry.
I don’t fully agree with your criticisms, but I recognise that they’re positive in their intent.
That makes them different from the criticism I once raised against people who wrote poems here. I was very scathing,. I was quite an a-hole, holding a ‘superior’ standard of literary criticism as a criterion against which I could laugh at people and their puny efforts. I was an -a-hole
.Some would say I still am
but so far they have yet to convince me.Someone called mizzy (lol
) convinced me just how much of an a-hole I was in poetry, taking a positive and encouraging attitude to everyone’s attempts.What a shame that you tend to push the self-destruct button when you make cruel criticisms of some of the people here. Nasty and cruel. You devalue yourself. We all know you can be clever and withering, but to what end when you seek to humiliate people?
Humiliating people isn’t something to be proud of. We do it too often without meaning to, so actually setting out to humiliate is just not on at all. Everyone has their own hard battle to wage, without you (or I) making it worse.
That won’t stop me being withering in my ciriticms of other people’s opinions, but that’s different. That not humiliating them, it’s engaging with their argument. That’s how progress occurs – or should occur, anyway.
So keep your finger off the self-destruct button (self-destruct is something in which we all excel) and you can shine
That would make a wonderful poem you know. Your comments are very worthy of it.
Very elegantly put. although I would not say you were totally eloquent. My point was merely to remind that people should try to make the words in the sentence make sense.
Here is a response to your comment.
They comment harshly and try to ‘ridicule’??
As they have never themselves been humiliated or treated like a fool?
No they are just so withering that they misfire?
Pointing their gun at random’s over a crossed wire?
What end do they seek? making less sense is a blunder
Words can be magical, words can be a wonder
Putting into rhyme how you feel inside
Face the truth and don’t run and hide
Some can critisise others for their personality
Judging them harshly and ridiculously
So the point is that when walking on someone else’s turf
They might therefore point out their worth
Since being belittled by folk who then appear
Stuck in the trenches they just cannot hear
That words are important and should therefore be true
There are reasons for everything that some people do
So your assumptions are based on only what you can see
There is so much more to this truthfully
Only the innocent get to be ‘hurt’
Were they so ‘humiliated’ when they raked up the dirt?
‘Devalue’ that word is nasty and cruel?
Negative and spiteful if you follow your rule
So many things here are ‘justified’ on others terms
They are still tending their gardens to find their worms
They are shining in their own way
They are shining every single day
At the end of the day we reap what we sow
Self destruct button – No that just is not so
Gliding under the veil of their hypocricy
Transparent in its simplicity
If words make no sense what real meaning is there?
To make the reader ‘feel’ and to really care?
Typical of what is already known
The ground frosted over and that bird has now flown
Pointless defending pointless to explain
You don’t need an umbrella when you dance in the rain
The very fact that you are not ‘aware’
Makes the reader just forget to care(referring to this particular reader)
trench is related to misfire, crossed wire, gun
many reference to ‘gardens’
Very elegantly put. although I would not say you were totally eloquent.
Aha! Touché!!
My point was merely to remind that people should try to make the words in the sentence make sense.
Or maybe not!
I wasn’t writing either a poem or a polished piece of prose. I didn’t check over every word, it was done in a hurry to make a point (or two).
But even so I disagree with your argument that every word has to ‘make sense’.
You’re absolutely right if you’re referring to mixed metaphors. many an undergrad has had fun picking apart Joyce Kilmer’s poem, Trees, and the confusions that result from the constant shifting of meaning in the basic image.
But first, words are ambiguous, have multiple meanings. When Ms Sass uses the word ‘heart’, she’s not actually referring to the heart as an organ in the body. If she were, then it would have struck her as bizarre to talk of the heart listening. but ‘heart’ has many meanings, and Ms Sass is using the word as an image for loving, caring,etc. You restrict the word to only one narrow meaning.
You did the same, by the way, with my use of the word ‘withering’. Of course, machine gun fire from a trench is withering, but the adjective isn’t restricted to one noun. It can be as easily used of the term criticism.
Secondly, why should words necessarily make sense in a poem? I have a friend who is an accomplished artist who knew of my interest in poetry and asked for help in understanding what seemed to be beyond understanding. I said that she should treat the poem as a picture. It doesn’t tell a story, at least not a straight story. It describes its subject-matter through images, not narrative (or can do, there’s no rule even for this). I advised her not to try to make sense of the poem, but to follow the image and let it do the painting. The meaning can emerge at the end, and can be more profound than a simple communication.
Try to read the poem, my father moved through dooms of love, by e.e.cummings, and the words are not clear – not until you suss out what the poet is trying to do.
To quote one of of my fave poets, Basil Bunting,
Can you trace shuttles thrown
like drops from a fountain, spray, mist of spiderlines,
bearing the rainbow, quoits round the draped moon;
shuttles like random dust desert whirlwinds hoy at their tormenting sun?
Follow the clue patiently and you will understand nothing.
And btw cruelty isn’t justified if it’s in response to cruelty, especially when the resulting battle becomes a descent into an endless nastiness which obliterates anything good you’re saying.
2 members liked this post.
while I’m thinking, it’s the last line of the Bunting quotation – “Follow the clue patiently and you will understand nothing” – which is the important one.
1 member liked this post.
You are correct I am writing of love and he knows who he is. Thank you for your words you sound very intelligent. I love poems and wish I were better. I really love painting and drawings they are my passion
Very elegantly put. although I would not say you were totally eloquent.
Aha! Touché!!
My point was merely to remind that people should try to make the words in the sentence make sense.
Or maybe not!
I wasn’t writing either a poem or a polished piece of prose. I didn’t check over every word, it was done in a hurry to make a point (or two).
But even so I disagree with your argument that every word has to ‘make sense’.
You’re absolutely right if you’re referring to mixed metaphors. many an undergrad has had fun picking apart Joyce Kilmer’s poem, Trees, and the confusions that result from the constant shifting of meaning in the basic image.
But first, words are ambiguous, have multiple meanings. When Ms Sass uses the word ‘heart’, she’s not actually referring to the heart as an organ in the body. If she were, then it would have struck her as bizarre to talk of the heart listening. but ‘heart’ has many meanings, and Ms Sass is using the word as an image for loving, caring,etc. You restrict the word to only one narrow meaning.
You did the same, by the way, with my use of the word ‘withering’. Of course, machine gun fire from a trench is withering, but the adjective isn’t restricted to one noun. It can be as easily used of the term criticism.
Secondly, why should words necessarily make sense in a poem? I have a friend who is an accomplished artist who knew of my interest in poetry and asked for help in understanding what seemed to be beyond understanding. I said that she should treat the poem as a picture. It doesn’t tell a story, at least not a straight story. It describes its subject-matter through images, not narrative (or can do, there’s no rule even for this). I advised her not to try to make sense of the poem, but to follow the image and let it do the painting. The meaning can emerge at the end, and can be more profound than a simple communication.
Try to read the poem, my father moved through dooms of love, by e.e.cummings, and the words are not clear – not until you suss out what the poet is trying to do.
To quote one of of my fave poets, Basil Bunting,
Can you trace shuttles thrown
like drops from a fountain, spray, mist of spiderlines,
bearing the rainbow, quoits round the draped moon;
shuttles like random dust desert whirlwinds hoy at their tormenting sun?
Follow the clue patiently and you will understand nothing.
And btw cruelty isn’t justified if it’s in response to cruelty, especially when the resulting battle becomes a descent into an endless nastiness which obliterates anything good you’re saying.
Making sense is handy when trying to understand and engage.
Do we stand corrected? No, not really. The point made still stands. If people are only writing for themselves then why bother sharing it in the first place?
You are very knowledgeable of all things poetry.
We are all looking forward to seeing your prose.
Do we stand corrected? No, not really. The point made still stands. If people are only writing for themselves then why bother sharing it in the first place
Well, that’s a problem for us all. In a sense, we often find ourselves – many of us – basically writing for ourselves in the hope that others will read them properly.Ms Sass was writing her poem for someone, and she thinks he got the message.Poetry is interesting to me when it’s not clear – we have to figure out what is being communicated, and often it’s music rather than narrative. We have to develop an ear for it.No idea why the size of the words has gone all wonky
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This reply was modified 5 years, 10 months ago by sceptical guy.
1 member liked this post.
We are all looking forward to seeing your prose.
On political arguments, my prose communicates through a combination of analysis and dialectical argument. It’s never straightforward, and requires an awareness that the argument can be subtle and balanced.
My prose on this thread seems to have been understood clearly enough.
Any comment on the inadequacy of my prose is always welcome
, though. I can make bloopers. -
This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by
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