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Posts
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Mags… Where do our inbuilt morals come from? Please don’t accuse me of preaching, my views on morals dont stem from my faith, trust me, if they did, I would be doomed. So are you saying that cheating is wrong, immoral, in every single instance?
Our moral compass comes from a combination of nurture and nature ( inherited genetic predispositions and experiences in life) Do you read the bible to see if you can put the wrong colour bins out on a given day then echo ?
I already told you I haven’t read a lot of it
I’m happy to debate with you but please don’t assume that just because I believe in God that I am somehow inferior to you or attack my beliefs. I’m not critisizing you for not believing, please don’t make this about my beliefs.
Why do you think cheating is wrong? I don’t necessarily disagree with you, I’m just trying to debate it with you.
all the christian myths and morals existed long before christianity did in pagan religions
it is all pagan origins
christianity does not have a monopoly on morality far from it
I’ll answer the creep’s slanders on a more relevant thread.
I don’t see divorce as a sin – it’s often an escape from deep unhappiness and even suicide.
But you introduced sin in a religious context. Adultery is a sin. Living in sin, is a sin. Marrying a divorcee is a sin. Religion based morality, sin, just leads down a one way street. Not even getting into gender equality, according to the bible.
The most unpleasant set of posts here lately (so far) seems to be provided by an upholder of ‘morality’ against sin – a real Old Testament type, with his denunciation of a woman tryng to resolve her problem as a ‘moo’.
It is interesting how the posts you refer to are not much different to that of the Old Testament and the language used not much different. As you say, sin has merely been replaced by morality.
Yes, I see sin in a religious context. Without religion, sin takes on an entirely different meaning. Sin can be defined by the creep as anything he doesn’t like, and he’d be right to define it so.
Sin can also be defined by you, Gerry, as you don’t seem to take a religious approach. I address you as you now strike me as a serious man who can help me sharpen my beliefs and my argument. But why should your approach to sin be right and the approach of the creep be wrong? There’s no god to judge you or him or any of us. We can sit and make up what is sin. That’s true of a man i am coming to take seriously but it’s also true of Hitler. If there’s no God, why is Hitler wrong??
I don’t accept any of the things you mention as sins – necessarily. I’m not sure why you think I do. I do think that there’s such a thing as sin, which I define very differently from nemesis (I think?), and I don’t think a lake of fire awaits those who fall into them. I do think people are punished severely for sin – but here on earth. I don’t think anyone goes to hell after their death – or purgatory. I may be wrong, and people and churches I respect do believe this, but I can only say what I think.
Going to jc and reading the creep is part of the punishment for sin. There are even worse punishments.
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Scep.. At the risk of turning this into another “God” thread, the “mark” is absolute truth, perfection. We all fall short of that. If there is a God, who are we to judge? If there isn’t, who are we to judge? Who decides what’s right or wrong? The couple I am talking about have been married over twenty years, she is cheating with one man, a man she “uses” for sex. Why, when she loves her husband is what she is doing any more wrong than using a vibrator? And just to make my position clear, I am just offering a different view to the norm.
Nemesis,
I don’t see that as the mark. Nobody can reach that impossible mark, and not just when it comes to adultery. That makes the mark senseless – worse than useless. You just do what you want and assume that if you’re going to get punished for it the so is everybody else and you’ll be punished anyway. So i don’t think your criterion is one whihc makes any real sense.
I’m saying this in all seriousness because I think you’ve thought about it a lot, and that you’ve had the courage to approach it by the light of your own reasoning and experience. I’m disputing your point because I’m trying to sharpen my own moral beliefs, and in the hope that any discussion we have may sharpen yours too.
I don’t see your friend as sinning. I think she’s making a moral choice, believe it or not, and not telling her husband is part of that moral choice.
Sceptical it is irrelevant though what your personal views are if you quote sin from a religious viewpoint. These religion based discussions just go round and round. Picking and choosing what parts of the bible, Old or New, are relevant or not, air brushes out the bigger picture, that the bible Old and New, treats women as inferior both in marriage and infidelity.
Morality is subjective anyway. In France for example it is the norm to have a bit on the side, a cinq à sept and it hasn’t broken their society, far from it and divorce is lower than here in the UK. etc.
all the christian myths and morals existed long before christianity did in pagan religions it is all pagan origins christianity does not have a monopoly on morality far from it
that’s very true, crumpet.
but it’s not really arguing anything.
Your moral view on adultery is that all cheats should be shot (see p.1 of this thread). This is a very moral position, and some would say that it’s a rather harsh morality.
so your statement of fact about the origins of morality needs to be pursued more if you’re going to justify your view. Unless that view was just an emotional reaction -which would be very understandable, if wrong (imho).
I love that term imho. Someone has already effectively taken the mickey out of me for using it on my mobile lol
Mags… Where do our inbuilt morals come from? Please don’t accuse me of preaching, my views on morals dont stem from my faith, trust me, if they did, I would be doomed. So are you saying that cheating is wrong, immoral, in every single instance?
Our moral compass comes from a combination of nurture and nature ( inherited genetic predispositions and experiences in life) Do you read the bible to see if you can put the wrong colour bins out on a given day then echo ?
I already told you I haven’t read a lot of it
I’m happy to debate with you but please don’t assume that just because I believe in God that I am somehow inferior to you or attack my beliefs. I’m not critisizing you for not believing, please don’t make this about my beliefs. Why do you think cheating is wrong? I don’t necessarily disagree with you, I’m just trying to debate it with you.so if you “don’t read it a lot” why do you profess to follow a religion based on something you say you know nothing about? It seems to be a common theme from religious folk, they claim to be following a religion but haven’t a clue what the religion they claim to follow incorporates in verbal or written form.
What do you mean ” why do I think cheating is wrong”? You imply then you don’t think that, which is just as bizarre as your claims to be a Christian but not reading the bible.
Sceptical it is irrelevant though what your personal views are if you quote sin from a religious viewpoint. These religion based discussions just go round and round. Picking and choosing what parts of the bible, Old or New, are relevant or not, air brushes out the bigger picture, that the bible Old and New, treats women as inferior both in marriage and infidelity. Morality is subjective anyway. In France for example it is the norm to have a bit on the side, a cinq à sept and it hasn’t broken their society, far from it and divorce is lower than here in the UK. etc.
Well, I’ve not used either the New or the Old Testament yet, though i would disagree strongly that the NT takes a view of women as inferior. Paul most certainly does, but Paul isn’t the whole of the NT.
I use the term religious in the way nemesis does…as pointing to a criterion of sin whihc lies outside my personal judgement. both of us may be wrong, but if we are then the consequence is that anybody is right – whether it be the creep, you, me or Hitler to use three extremely different characters as an example.
Agreed re France. As a counterexample whihc proves your point, New York has made adultery a criminal offence. One woman took her husband to court in NY, and when he pointed to her adultery she reacted by showing that she had been adulterous in new jersey, where adultery is not illegal.
New York is where they invented adultery, I believe. Certainly there are more than one couple who’ve practised it without being imprisoned. I have heard it argued that you’re not seen as a proper New Yorker unless you’ve committed it, though that may be a slander.
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I’ll answer the creep’s slanders on a more relevant thread.
I don’t see divorce as a sin – it’s often an escape from deep unhappiness and even suicide.
But you introduced sin in a religious context. Adultery is a sin. Living in sin, is a sin. Marrying a divorcee is a sin. Religion based morality, sin, just leads down a one way street. Not even getting into gender equality, according to the bible.
The most unpleasant set of posts here lately (so far) seems to be provided by an upholder of ‘morality’ against sin – a real Old Testament type, with his denunciation of a woman tryng to resolve her problem as a ‘moo’.
It is interesting how the posts you refer to are not much different to that of the Old Testament and the language used not much different. As you say, sin has merely been replaced by morality.
Yes, I see sin in a religious context. Without religion, sin takes on an entirely different meaning. Sin can be defined by the creep as anything he doesn’t like, and he’d be right to define it so. Sin can also be defined by you, Gerry, as you don’t seem to take a religious approach. I address you as you now strike me as a serious man who can help me sharpen my beliefs and my argument. But why should your approach to sin be right and the approach of the creep be wrong? There’s no god to judge you or him or any of us. We can sit and make up what is sin. That’s true of a man i am coming to take seriously but it’s also true of Hitler. If there’s no God, why is Hitler wrong?? I don’t accept any of the things you mention as sins – necessarily. I’m not sure why you think I do. I do think that there’s such a thing as sin, which I define very differently from nemesis (I think?), and I don’t think a lake of fire awaits those who fall into them. I do think people are punished severely for sin – but here on earth. I don’t think anyone goes to hell after their death – or purgatory. I may be wrong, and people and churches I respect do believe this, but I can only say what I think. Going to jc and reading the creep is part of the punishment for sin. There are even worse punishments.
You’ve been told already that sin doesn’t exist out of any pretext of a “God” yet you still refer to it.. do you even know the difference between sin and morality? Incidentally the definition of a creep is someone making sleazy unwanted advances which sums up your flowery kiss philosophy on every thread a female appears on- you by definition are one of the worst creeps on here and also unable to differentiate between sin and morality.
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