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Not sure my one comment about emu oil is an indication of all Brits being cruel to animals, but it is a tricky thing, unless you’re the type of vegetarian who doesn’t use any by products from the meat industry you can’t avoid it.
@jen_jen wrote:
@blossom‘ wrote:
@jen_jen wrote:
I assume you’re a vegetarian then…
And your definition of vegetarian is…
Same as the Vegetarian Society’s:
A vegetarian does not eat meat, poultry, game, fish, shellfish or crustacea, or by-products of slaughter.
What’s your definition?
My definition of a vegetarian is the same as the one given by the Vegetarian Society, in addition to that I’d include that a vegetarian shouldn’t be using any cleaning products/cosmetics/toiletries/or any other product in which any cruelty to animals is involved.
Having said that, there aren’t that many people who can call themselves true vegetarians, unless they’re hermits living in the middle of nowhere, most wash themselves and do their laundry in my humble opinion, it’s rather difficult to come across any product which hasn’t been tested on animals at some point of their making, some ingredients in these products were initially tested on animals, long before any legislation against animal cruelty exisited, so it’s not that simple to be 100% sure what is now sold as an ‘animal friendly” product is truly what it states to be.
So no, I can’t call myself a vegetarian.
My point was however, why do we have to use products which hit you in the face with the fact they’ve been made with slaughtered animals or have clearly caused any suffering to animals by what they state on the label?
I don’t want to sound like a hypocrite, but I find it rather cruel, as there are other options, but perhaps that’s just me.@blossom‘ wrote:
My definition of a vegetarian is the same as the one given by the Vegetarian Society, in addition to that I’d include that a vegetarian shouldn’t be using any cleaning products/cosmetics/toiletries/or any other product in which any cruelty to animals is involved.
Doesn’t that depend on why they are vegetarians? I have several friends who are vegetarians but 2 in particular spring to mind; 1 is vegetarian because she simply doesn’t like the taste or texture of meat, the other is vegetarian because meat and fish make her medical condition worse. Both will happily wear leather shoes and coats and eat sweets containing gelatine and use other animal related products.
@blossom‘ wrote:
My point was however, why do we have to use products which hit you in the face with the fact they’ve been made with slaughtered animals or have clearly caused any suffering to animals by what they state on the label?
I don’t want to sound like a hypocrite, but I find it rather cruel, as there are other options, but perhaps that’s just me.If you are in continuous long term pain you long for relief. The body builds up a resistance to conventional medication so you end up taking more and more pills, poisoning your body, for less and less effect. It’s not just the physical side, it’s the mental and emotional impact too, it wears you down and lowers your immune system…I could go on but you get the picture. Whilst we would all prefer to have an effective remedy that doesn’t cause any suffering to any animal, there are days when someone in pain would take almost anything just for some blessed relief.
I am not a vegetarian; I have always known and have now had it confirmed by a clinical nutritionist that I need some meat in my diet, a minimum of 2 to 3 times a week. Having said that, I try to ensure that the meat is as ethically sourced as possible with the minimum suffering to the animal.
The Aborigines, who are credited with discovering the medicinal properties of emu oil, the Native Americans and many other indigenous groups had a similar view to animals. Only take what you need, i.e. don’t kill for the fun of it; give thanks to the animal for giving it’s life so that you can be fed and clothed; use as much of the animal as you can out of respect to the sacrifice the animal has made. I like that approach. And I would prefer the products that I use to make it clear what’s in them, not hide it in some gobbledegook list of ingredients in tiny lettering that you need a magnifying glass to read.
But perhaps that’s just me. :wink:
interesting posts from you two ladies………..what about the term ‘vegan’?……..heard it many times and always associated it with no meat, no dairy, no leather goods, no cleaning or cosmetics that are tested on animals etc……….in other words ‘no nothing’
neither of you mentioned this…………curious meat eater here
If God hadn’t wanted us to eat animals why did he make them taste of meat :shock: just saying like :?
@tinks wrote:
interesting posts from you two ladies………..what about the term ‘vegan’?……..heard it many times and always associated it with no meat, no dairy, no leather goods, no cleaning or cosmetics that are tested on animals etc……….in other words ‘no nothing’
neither of you mentioned this…………curious meat eater here
A vegan does not eat anything that comes from an animal, alive or dead, and may extend this into not using any products that come from animal derivatives. Like vegetarians, the extent that they embrace it depends on their reasons for adopting it in the first place.
My ex followed a vegan diet for a while as it is supposed to help reverse type 2 diabetes. It did bring his blood sugar levels down but it was very restrictive…eating out was a nightmare, even vegetarian restaurants didn’t seem able to cater very well for vegans. He was doing it for health reasons though and still wore leather shoes, wool and so on which got some funny looks when he was asking for vegan food rather than vegetarian.
I did work with a vegan many years ago who did it for moral reasons and it seemed to become an obsession. He ate more processed food than anyone I knew though and I was never convinced that it was healthy, nor was I convinced when he squeezed a grey gloop out of a tube like a tomato puree tube, spread it onto a dry cracker, took a bite then rolled his eyes and pronounced “mmmmm mushroom pate, yum yum”.
Each to their own.
Clear arguments being presented here.
Like, Kenty, I’m not an animal lover, but I don’t like to see animals in pain, or killed.
But when human pain can be eased, I see animals as coming second.
Blossom, why shouldn’t animals be killed if human pain can be reduced? I don’t understand why animals should be as important as human beings (that doesn’t mean that animals shouldn’t be well-cared for, or cruelty to animals punished)??
@blossom‘ wrote:
My definition of a vegetarian is the same as the one given by the Vegetarian Society, in addition to that I’d include that a vegetarian shouldn’t be using any cleaning products/cosmetics/toiletries/or any other product in which any cruelty to animals is involved.
Doesn’t that depend on why they are vegetarians? I have several friends who are vegetarians but 2 in particular spring to mind; 1 is vegetarian because she simply doesn’t like the taste or texture of meat, the other is vegetarian because meat and fish make her medical condition worse. Both will happily wear leather shoes and coats and eat sweets containing gelatine and use other animal related products.
Yes, I was referring to those who become vegetarians due to ethical reasons.
@sceptical guy wrote:
Clear arguments being presented here.
Like, Kenty, I’m not an animal lover, but I don’t like to see animals in pain, or killed.
But when human pain can be eased, I see animals as coming second.
Blossom, why shouldn’t animals be killed if human pain can be reduced? I don’t understand why animals should be as important as human beings (that doesn’t mean that animals shouldn’t be well-cared for, or cruelty to animals punished)??
All living beings feel pain, the same as humans do, I don’t see why they should suffer for the sake of science/to reduce our pain, they’re not the ones with the ailments, after all.
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