Somer,

from one who bangs on about human rights (as well as the EU),

the British woman jailed in Iran is an awful case. It’s been caught up in international politics, unfortunately, so the rights and the wrongs of her argument go by the board.

The only lesson I can see is that if you get caught up in these problems, it’s damned difficult sometimes for the UK to get you out of it. We are no longer the power that we were.

Saving the endangered baby may have been impossible – but no attempt was even made. Quite the opposite.

In the Iranian case, the government is at least making an attempt to free the woman – though Boris Johnson (our future leader?!!) put his foot in it at the start.

The government is the culprit in the denying the human rights of the baby.

3 school all groomed at the same time?

Getting back to the main subject. Whos to blame? Sharmeena Begun( not to be confused with Shamima Begum) was the first girl who left alone in dec 2014 two months later her three friends followed. Sharmeena Begun used to ask her father to take her to the mosque it was at this mosque that Sharmeena was first radicalised, most likely by members of a women’s wing of the Islamic Forum of Europe known as ‘Sisters Forum’ or ‘Muslimaat’. Sharmeena’s  uncle told the press 4 years ago that she was told she will go to paradise. Her uncle quoted ” i am 500 per cent sure she was groomed at the East London Mosque. She was spending most of her time in the mosque, after school and all the time, she was spending in the mosque” One of the other three girls whos father is Abase Hussen who took his daughter then aged 13 to a ” hate preacher rally”  was filmed burning flags standing next to Michael Adebolajo , the other killer of Lee Rigby. It sickens me to watch Abase Husse clutching one of her teddy bears while telling the press, he could think of ‘nothing’ to explain why she and two friends had decided to join IS,as the families blamed the authorities for failing to stop them. as well as keeping quiet about his own links to radicalism! What about the mosque? Might any fingers be  pointed there? Four years ago, when Shamima and friends went out to join ISIS, Muslim leaders in Britain were very fast to blame the internet for the radicalisation. The other girl Shamina Begum whos 3 children are deceased why did she ask to come back to the UK so close to the birth of her baby?Why  did she  wait until the other two died? its not the way any mother would act or behave .  I don’t think any airline would accept you at almost 9 mths into a pregnancy? . Why did the airline in the UK allow 3 youngsters to leave the country? from my experience you are classed as a child .A passenger at the age 14 or 15 years can only travel on a direct flight from a UK airport must have a young persons declaration form and must be completed by a parent. The people who do bear some responsibility should be called out, prosecuted, punished, deported or imprisoned. That is what a sane society would do.  The only people to blame are those who influenced them, probably people they knew, grew up with , lived with and hung around with.  They were also old enough to understand the wrongfulness of their behaviour. I am only sad that children had to suffer because of their actions.

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somer1

Sophia,

that isn’t actually the main subject of the thread, which is about who is to blame for the death of Shamima Begum’s baby. This has been quite closely argued out, The legality of not allowing Shamima to return is a closely connected topic.

You’re travelling along a tangent on whether the girls were groomed or not.

They are not angels – they stole jewellery from their devout Muslim families, sold it to finance their flight, and Shamima is thought to have used her older sister’s passport to get past the airport gates. She looks older than her age.

But she was still only 15, which means that however intelligent she was (and she does seem to have been bright), she was as daft as a brush, like most 15 year-old girls. Girls grow up pretty damn quick later on, and generally become much more mature than most lads, but not at 15 they don’t.

So these three bright gals, daft as they come, lied and stole from their devout families in order to travel blithely to Hell.

They were put in a woman’s house, and there were forcibly married to hardened ISIS fighters.

Its up to the British authorities, not you or I, to find out how dangerous she is. None of us know of any ulterior motives for her coming, but she’s not been doing herself any favours with her interviews, though she appeared pretty depressed over the danger to her baby.

Could I ask you, Sophia, what the sources are for your information? I looked up Sharmeena Begun, for example, and I can’t find a single reference to her. Ditto with her family – I’m not saying you’re wrong, but I’d like to know where you get this from. I’d just like to be assured that it’s not lies from some of the Britain First propaganda machine, that’s all.

I used the following to get my info for this post – https://www.iol.co.za/news/world/severed-head-didnt-faze-me-says-jihadi-bride-who-ran-away-from-home-at-15-19322229

None of what you say, true or false, affects the main argument of the thread, which is that the British State is responsible for the death of a baby for which it was ultimately responsible (see my post a couple of pages back, if you are interested in looking at an opposing argument), and that it’s the nationality, not the saintliness, of Shamima Begum which is at issue.

Scep, what’s done is done. You harp on to a tedious and excessive extent that i can’t be bothered reading your long drawn out arguments of which you feel is a one man crusade of you’re right i’m wrong attitude . If anyone feels that passionate about this woman and her baby they should write to whoever they feel was to blame? Arguements, discussions on chatroom boards really arent the place and being honest doesnt really help the cause.  Im done with this subject now.